Owen's Practice Journal, Part II

Nimitta Sutta
www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/an/an03....100.11-15.than.html


"A monk intent on heightened mind should attend periodically to three themes: he should attend periodically to the theme of concentration; he should attend periodically to the theme of uplifted energy; he should attend periodically to the theme of equanimity. If the monk intent on heightened mind were to attend solely to the theme of concentration, it is possible that his mind would tend to laziness. If he were to attend solely to the theme of uplifted energy, it is possible that his mind would tend to restlessness. If he were to attend solely to the theme of equanimity, it is possible that his mind would not be rightly centered for the stopping of the fermentations. But when he attends periodically to the theme of concentration, attends periodically to the theme of uplifted energy, attends periodically to the theme of equanimity, his mind is pliant, malleable, luminous, & not brittle. It is rightly centered for the stopping of the fermentations."

Haven't updated this in a long while, so here I go.
It appears (according to the 7 stage model) I've somehow gotten stage 7 before I got 6. Interesting. Seems to have happened a few months back, but I didn't really put it together until my recent conversation with Kenneth. So there is still thought/body sensation glomming into emotions going on, but the self-reference shock is gone. My "I" sense is now read as just more phenomena. So just a new bit of data for those into map making. It would appear that post stage 5 the rest of the possible attainments are non-linear. It appears that you get what you practice for. Current practice phase, dealing with my neurotic ass.

could you describe "the self-reference shock is gone" in more detail? You say "My "I" sense is now read as just more phenomena." - isn't that what happens at 4th path though? you seem to still have an "I" sense, otherwise how would you know that the more phenomena you're reading is just more phenomena instead of an "I" sense? i don't know what i'm talking about which is why i'm asking =P

4th path/5th stage is a cognitive dis-embedding. The sense of self still arises, although it is seen as not-self in real time and as such the hooks of suffering are removed. Even still, when it (the self sense, the ego, the little "I") arises and is seen there can persist an unpleasant somatic charge. This is what goes away at 7. Make sense?

i think so. so no sensations that imply an 'i' arise any longer? i was just confused by your phrasing, "my "I" sense is now read as just more phenomena". do you still have an "I" sense or is it just gone?

Yep, I still have an "I" sense. It just seems to include everything in my awareness (when I'm being mindful). Others also seem like "me". This body is alive and vital, there is a sense of being, but it just does not stop at the skin.

ah i see. so the pain of the 'i' sense arising is what is gone, and the 'i' sense itself has shifted to be all sensations.

1) is this a state that you were able to get into before 7th stage, but it was temporary, and now the shift made it permanent?

2) how does it differ from consciousness taking consciousness as an object (what i think kenneth called 2nd gear)? i tried doing that and got into a neat state (eyes closed) where each sensation was both the sensation and the watching of the sensation, and there was a sensation overlaid to it all of like a big 'me' humorously watching it, which was also just a sensation along with the watching of the sensation at once. well firstly, is that 2nd gear? secondly, how does that differ from what you experience now?

"It would appear that post stage 5 the rest of the possible attainments are non-linear. It appears that you get what you practice for. Current practice phase, dealing with my neurotic ass.
"

i guess this also means stage 7 isn't equivalent to eradicating the last 5 fetters? ('neurotic ass' sounds like restlessness =P)

Perhaps finishing up the 6th stage will take care of that...

That's the plan.

"1) is this a state that you were able to get into before 7th stage, but it was temporary, and now the shift made it permanent?

2) how does it differ from consciousness taking consciousness as an object (what i think kenneth called 2nd gear)? i tried doing that and got into a neat state (eyes closed) where each sensation was both the sensation and the watching of the sensation, and there was a sensation overlaid to it all of like a big 'me' humorously watching it, which was also just a sensation along with the watching of the sensation at once. well firstly, is that 2nd gear? secondly, how does that differ from what you experience now?"

1) Sorta, there were glimpses. But when it happened, it was a big shift to a new baseline.
2) Consciousness is not separate from the objects of consciousness. Without the object, there is no consciousness, just an unending awareness that is equally present in every state. That is what the sense of "me" has moved to, at least when I'm mindful.

what about when you're not mindful?

I can get lost in thought.

I spent pretty much all of yesterday working with some researchers out at Yale doing an FMRI study of meditators. I'm going to write up a good sized article about it on the hamilton project, but for now I'm happy to report that the dynamic jhana method basically got confirmed via neuro imaging. More deails to come.

Where you able to attain Nirodha in the machine? What happened?

COOOOOL!!!!

Yeah, 8 jhanas in 3 minutes + NS. My brain was kinda pudding like for a while after that.
I had a neurofeed graph that showed spikes whenever I adverted to the next jhana and deep blue lines whenever I was abiding.

Twas much fun. Jud (the researcher) said that traditional samatha jhana folks were showing hard blue on the graph the entire time, but stayed in the same jhana.

Fun stuff =). What did the graph show when you entered + remained in + exited NS? Did you also try insight nyanas and fruitions from equanimity?

Just showed blue for absorbtion and red for when I jumped into the next jhana. NS showed as blue for the particular brian region they were mapping. I did a few fruitions, but I don't have data for those runs.

Ah so they couldn't differentiate between jhanas? So the traditional samatha jhana folks might have been getting to higher+higher jhanas, just very slowly? (Just wild guesses here =P)

Don't know. I don't get the data, only watched the graphs while in the machine. They said it was going to take a lot of 4th pathers to get a good baseline. What they were looking for was the difference in the "default state" of the brain between controls/meditators/ and folks with attainments.

My recent practice is to try and note at around one second intervals from the moment I first wake up in the morning to the time I fall asleep. This morning my first conscious breath was an in breath. This seems to only be possible when I'm not doing something I need to be tightly absorbed in, like computer programming or having demanding conversations. Basically though, whenever I'm moving around or doing anything that doesn't require full focus, I'm noting. A few interesting things are happening:

1. Regardless of my body sensations, my mind state is really very nice even when in some distressing or anxiety prone situations. This is the mode about 90-95% of the time. Emotionally, I've calmed down a ton. There can arise some majorly uncomfortable physical sensations, but the thoughts aren't being followed much past the initially arising one. I now am aware of the majority of my "fun issues".

2. If feels now very strange when I notice being caught in narrative thinking. I can stay out of it when I'm mindful, but it is not the default yet. I can reliably get into it, but I staying there without effort isn't yet possible. I'm now reading gaps in awareness as being more and more unsettling.

3. I am also noticing a discreet lag between an action and the "selfing" of that action. It appears that my ego keeps trying to own what this mind and body are doing. That takes pretty clear attention to watch in real time, and it can throw the noting for a loop if the ego is trying to also own the noting.

4. I'm also finding it helpful to note in pairs of mindstate-feeling tone and mind object/feeling tone. Noting triplets and quads isn't working so well lately, since my mind objects always wind up being "investigating thoughts".

Anyway, that's what's going on these days. This has been an interesting experiment so far.

It's been over a week since I've experienced any glomming of thought and emotion. Body does it's thing and thoughts happen. Being rather insistent about the deadman and the tollbooth. I've never had this kind of consistent mind state. The worst it gets is somewhat neutral. I'm also noticing my body basically just responds to the situation, what I once perceived as anxiety just comes up as a physical sensation and I just smile at it. Don't know what else to say, I've become pretty happy and boring. Curious if this continues.

Keep your hand on the switch, Owen! Having sustained it for a week, you can sustain it for two. If you can sustain it for two, you can sustain it for four. By the time you have lived like this for six weeks, you have probably seen through the mirage of mind states for good. Body sensations will continue to arise as richly as before, but you will no longer find a mind to have a state. What were previously seen as emotions are seen as body-states. At that point, you have a lot of options. You can cultivate the body states of joy, bliss, well being, and the Brahma Viharas, for example, and let the body states associated with irritation and annoyance atrophy. (This would be my recommendation.)



Kenneth

Sounds like a powerful practise, Owen! Keep it up and keep on posting how it develops

Interesting stuff!