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- Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
- cmarti
- Topic Author
15 years 1 month ago #65674
by cmarti
Maybe one of you can post this process step by step.... I'm sure others would like to try this.
Replied by cmarti on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
Maybe one of you can post this process step by step.... I'm sure others would like to try this.
- NikolaiStephenHalay
- Topic Author
15 years 1 month ago #65675
by NikolaiStephenHalay
Replied by NikolaiStephenHalay on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
Hi Chris,
We rose up the jhanic arc, first noting and then just letting it shift to each nana/jhana up to the 13th jhana. This got the concentration well ramped up. I think it is needed for a good jump into NS. From the 13th jhana, a resolve was made to hit NS. I just resolved for it to happen and let the focus gently fall on the third eye spot with a slight mental push downwards. Then I could feel the "sinking" begin as the absorption got darker and things started flicking off. This is where awareness became aware of itself as all the sinking and flicking off kept occuring, and then NS seemed to occur but this time it wasn't a black out, but there is a memory of a flash of white. I am finding it hard to remember the details, but it felt seamless as opposed to a normal non-experience of NS.
I think I need to do it a few more times to really tell if it was real or not. But to tell you the truth, I haven't experience 3rd gear for long periods ever before. Just brief moments. Last night I was definitely 3rd gearing it for over an hour or something very new to me was occurring. And today, it has affected my default state which seems awfully 3rd gearish. All the same, worthy of more exploration.
Nick
We rose up the jhanic arc, first noting and then just letting it shift to each nana/jhana up to the 13th jhana. This got the concentration well ramped up. I think it is needed for a good jump into NS. From the 13th jhana, a resolve was made to hit NS. I just resolved for it to happen and let the focus gently fall on the third eye spot with a slight mental push downwards. Then I could feel the "sinking" begin as the absorption got darker and things started flicking off. This is where awareness became aware of itself as all the sinking and flicking off kept occuring, and then NS seemed to occur but this time it wasn't a black out, but there is a memory of a flash of white. I am finding it hard to remember the details, but it felt seamless as opposed to a normal non-experience of NS.
I think I need to do it a few more times to really tell if it was real or not. But to tell you the truth, I haven't experience 3rd gear for long periods ever before. Just brief moments. Last night I was definitely 3rd gearing it for over an hour or something very new to me was occurring. And today, it has affected my default state which seems awfully 3rd gearish. All the same, worthy of more exploration.
Nick
- cmarti
- Topic Author
15 years 1 month ago #65676
by cmarti
Thanks, Nick. That's what I was looking for.
Replied by cmarti on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
Thanks, Nick. That's what I was looking for.
- cmarti
- Topic Author
15 years 1 month ago #65677
by cmarti
Also, when you guys say "3rd gear" can you be more precise about what the attributes of that are? Is it a state or not a state? What else would you call it? See, this "new" thing appearing to be a product of jhana-like activity I want to be very careful not to confuse another jhana-like state with what I experience in 3rd gear, which is definitely not a state. It just IS. It is the essence of IS.
Thanks!
Edit: for clarity of language.
Replied by cmarti on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
Also, when you guys say "3rd gear" can you be more precise about what the attributes of that are? Is it a state or not a state? What else would you call it? See, this "new" thing appearing to be a product of jhana-like activity I want to be very careful not to confuse another jhana-like state with what I experience in 3rd gear, which is definitely not a state. It just IS. It is the essence of IS.
Thanks!
Edit: for clarity of language.
- NikolaiStephenHalay
- Topic Author
15 years 1 month ago #65678
by NikolaiStephenHalay
Replied by NikolaiStephenHalay on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
When i say third gear, I am talking when there is just "ISness" for lack of a better way of describing it. No witness, no Nick, just ever present ISness. Just this unexplainable ISness. I don't know what else I could call it. When I talked in it, the words felt like they came from that ISNess. They felt like vibrations arising and passing away into that ISness.
Again, I have to do this a few more times to get a handle on the explanation. i might be talking out my arse. Suffice to say though, doing what I described has affected today's default state for the mind which hasn't really dissipated at all. Last night there was definitely something interesting that occurred after doing this. I think more yogis need to do it to see if Owen or I are not alone in this. It just feels like ISness, Chris. Not a state.
Again, I have to do this a few more times to get a handle on the explanation. i might be talking out my arse. Suffice to say though, doing what I described has affected today's default state for the mind which hasn't really dissipated at all. Last night there was definitely something interesting that occurred after doing this. I think more yogis need to do it to see if Owen or I are not alone in this. It just feels like ISness, Chris. Not a state.
- cmarti
- Topic Author
15 years 1 month ago #65679
by cmarti
I just tried this technique and the word "engraving" that Owen used earlier is very apt. It feels as if the mind is being imprinted with non-dual reality. It's a flash of light that seems to etch the thing onto the mind. So now I'm hanging in some kind of extended 3rd gear
Replied by cmarti on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
I just tried this technique and the word "engraving" that Owen used earlier is very apt. It feels as if the mind is being imprinted with non-dual reality. It's a flash of light that seems to etch the thing onto the mind. So now I'm hanging in some kind of extended 3rd gear

- OwenBecker
- Topic Author
15 years 1 month ago #65680
by OwenBecker
Replied by OwenBecker on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
"
I just tried this technique and the word "engraving" that Owen used earlier is very apt. It feels as if the mind is being imprinted with non-dual reality. It's a flash of light that seems to etch the thing onto the mind. So now I'm hanging in some kind of extended 3rd gear
"
Cool, thanks for confirming Chris. Can you describe in more detail the experience? I'm also curious what it does to your sleep state tonight.
I just tried this technique and the word "engraving" that Owen used earlier is very apt. It feels as if the mind is being imprinted with non-dual reality. It's a flash of light that seems to etch the thing onto the mind. So now I'm hanging in some kind of extended 3rd gear

"
Cool, thanks for confirming Chris. Can you describe in more detail the experience? I'm also curious what it does to your sleep state tonight.
- cmarti
- Topic Author
15 years 1 month ago #65681
by cmarti
Owen, I went up the jhanic arc to the 8th jhana as that's how I normally access NS. Didn't see the need to go any further.So at that point I started the usual downward push into NS and let that sort of "falling into a deed dark well" process start. At the point where the blackness got pretty deep and I could feel mental processes start shutting down I glanced around the figurative corner at the natural non-dual awareness that I can "see" when I want to. As you guys described, I resolved to bring that awareness into the chasm. Soon after that a mental image of brightness occurred and things got indistinct in a sort of blended way. Not abrupt.
What I recall then is like the really deep non-dual awareness I can achieve in deep, quiet meditation, where things seem gray-ish in tone (not white) and I can discern clearly that even space and time are mental constructs. There is nothing but pure core processing going on - just awareness being aware of itself with nothing to distract. Pure IS, no subject-object whatsoever.
So now there is non-dual awareness but less "concentrated." There is also a lot of energy flowing from the base of the spine up and out the crown. I also seem to have a nice "buzzy" feeling going. Sort of like a non-dual high. This is not now that really deep, meditative non-dual awareness but a more "awake," active-like version where everything is one but manifest.
Hope that helps.
Replied by cmarti on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
Owen, I went up the jhanic arc to the 8th jhana as that's how I normally access NS. Didn't see the need to go any further.So at that point I started the usual downward push into NS and let that sort of "falling into a deed dark well" process start. At the point where the blackness got pretty deep and I could feel mental processes start shutting down I glanced around the figurative corner at the natural non-dual awareness that I can "see" when I want to. As you guys described, I resolved to bring that awareness into the chasm. Soon after that a mental image of brightness occurred and things got indistinct in a sort of blended way. Not abrupt.
What I recall then is like the really deep non-dual awareness I can achieve in deep, quiet meditation, where things seem gray-ish in tone (not white) and I can discern clearly that even space and time are mental constructs. There is nothing but pure core processing going on - just awareness being aware of itself with nothing to distract. Pure IS, no subject-object whatsoever.
So now there is non-dual awareness but less "concentrated." There is also a lot of energy flowing from the base of the spine up and out the crown. I also seem to have a nice "buzzy" feeling going. Sort of like a non-dual high. This is not now that really deep, meditative non-dual awareness but a more "awake," active-like version where everything is one but manifest.
Hope that helps.
- cmarti
- Topic Author
15 years 1 month ago #65682
by cmarti
So... I think the take away for tonight is that while I've been able to access a similar seeming level of IS-ness for brief periods in the past by getting very, very quiet and deep in meditation, this seems to be another way to get to what appears to be a very similar "place." I'm not completely sure these two are the same but it seems so. Words fail on these points. of course, but hopefully you get the gist.
Replied by cmarti on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
So... I think the take away for tonight is that while I've been able to access a similar seeming level of IS-ness for brief periods in the past by getting very, very quiet and deep in meditation, this seems to be another way to get to what appears to be a very similar "place." I'm not completely sure these two are the same but it seems so. Words fail on these points. of course, but hopefully you get the gist.
- OwenBecker
- Topic Author
15 years 3 weeks ago #65683
by OwenBecker
Replied by OwenBecker on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
Almost no time to sit this week. Work is insane and I'm moving today. Note to self, the first arrow always keeps coming.
- cmarti
- Topic Author
15 years 3 weeks ago #65684
by cmarti
Yep, first arrow. I commiserate.
Replied by cmarti on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
Yep, first arrow. I commiserate.
- OwenBecker
- Topic Author
15 years 3 weeks ago #65685
by OwenBecker
Replied by OwenBecker on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
I have access to pure-land jhanas and states of bliss most people with never imagine. Also, my new neighbor enjoys practicing his trumpet at 9:00 AM on a Sunday.
My karma is entertaining.
My karma is entertaining.
- OwenBecker
- Topic Author
15 years 2 weeks ago #65686
by OwenBecker
Replied by OwenBecker on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
It is becoming clearer as I continue on this path that to practice simply for my own benefit is harmful. It seems to rather subtly reinforce the ego in a way that quickly becomes painful.
When I hit 4th path, I spent most of the day crying in gratitude because I was no longer a slave to an imaginary self. It was seen through, and reality became so much larger and more immediate. But my practice hasn't completely caught up with my insight, in a lot of ways, it is still all about me. And it can't continue to be. Not after what I've seen.
So, from now on, I'm going to start formally dedicating my practice to you folks. When I sit, it will be in the hope that it helps you to you wake up and understand the freedom that I've had the grace to enjoy. Any benefit, any peace I receive from my practice is done for you, so that my actions in my relationships with you are more skillful.
If anybody would like me to dedicate a sit to you personally and say your name out loud beforehand, please let me know.
Metta,
-o
When I hit 4th path, I spent most of the day crying in gratitude because I was no longer a slave to an imaginary self. It was seen through, and reality became so much larger and more immediate. But my practice hasn't completely caught up with my insight, in a lot of ways, it is still all about me. And it can't continue to be. Not after what I've seen.
So, from now on, I'm going to start formally dedicating my practice to you folks. When I sit, it will be in the hope that it helps you to you wake up and understand the freedom that I've had the grace to enjoy. Any benefit, any peace I receive from my practice is done for you, so that my actions in my relationships with you are more skillful.
If anybody would like me to dedicate a sit to you personally and say your name out loud beforehand, please let me know.
Metta,
-o
- ClaytonL
- Topic Author
15 years 2 weeks ago #65687
by ClaytonL
Replied by ClaytonL on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
I love seeing this kind of Maturity Owen... Keep up the good work...
- mumuwu
- Topic Author
15 years 2 weeks ago #65688
by mumuwu
Replied by mumuwu on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
I, Jayson Byrne, would very much appreciate a sit dedicated to my awakening, by you Owen Becker.
Metta!
Metta!
- OwenBecker
- Topic Author
15 years 2 weeks ago #65689
by OwenBecker
Replied by OwenBecker on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
"I, Jayson Byrne, would very much appreciate a sit dedicated to my awakening, by you Owen Becker.
Metta!"
Jason, a sit was just dedicated to you. May you awaken soon.
Metta!"
Jason, a sit was just dedicated to you. May you awaken soon.
- OwenBecker
- Topic Author
15 years 2 weeks ago #65690
by OwenBecker
Replied by OwenBecker on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
I just recently finished reading The Attention Revolution. There is a lot in it that I agree with and a lot I don't, but I'm curious if it is possible to develop shamatha to the degree described. Especially outside of a monastic context. So for the time being, I'm not doing anything but straight up breath counting with my attention fixed on the movement at the hara.
Due to some life suckage/ severe laziness, I haven't had a regular sitting schedule in a few weeks. Typically, the first sit back I would notice a huge drop in concentration ability, but it seems that it wasn't anywhere near as bad as it would have been before all the development work. I was still dealing with some pretty coarse excitation, but I was able to stay with the breath without losing count for about 30 minutes. Toward the end of it, I seemed to be leaning more toward medium laxity.
So hopefully this will be a fun little experiment. Anyway, it is far past time for me to master the concentration practices.
Due to some life suckage/ severe laziness, I haven't had a regular sitting schedule in a few weeks. Typically, the first sit back I would notice a huge drop in concentration ability, but it seems that it wasn't anywhere near as bad as it would have been before all the development work. I was still dealing with some pretty coarse excitation, but I was able to stay with the breath without losing count for about 30 minutes. Toward the end of it, I seemed to be leaning more toward medium laxity.
So hopefully this will be a fun little experiment. Anyway, it is far past time for me to master the concentration practices.
- Dadriance
- Topic Author
15 years 2 weeks ago #65691
by Dadriance
Replied by Dadriance on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
"If anybody would like me to dedicate a sit to you personally and say your name out loud beforehand, please let me know.
"
Thanks for the offer, Owen. I, Dave Adriance, would be grateful if you could dedicate a sit to my awakening.
With metta coming your way,
D.
"
Thanks for the offer, Owen. I, Dave Adriance, would be grateful if you could dedicate a sit to my awakening.
With metta coming your way,
D.
- OwenBecker
- Topic Author
15 years 2 weeks ago #65692
by OwenBecker
Replied by OwenBecker on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
"Thanks for the offer, Owen. I, Dave Adriance, would be grateful if you could dedicate a sit to my awakening.
With metta coming your way,
D."
I would be happy to. Thank you for helping my practice.
-o
With metta coming your way,
D."
I would be happy to. Thank you for helping my practice.
-o
- OwenBecker
- Topic Author
15 years 2 weeks ago #65693
by OwenBecker
Replied by OwenBecker on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
Just wanted to throw this out as reminder, the practice of me dedicating a sit is really good for my overactive ego; but if you want to wake up, it will be entirely your doing. Nobody can enlighten you, ever. The problem of life and death is yours alone, and the solution to it has to come from your own effort. If waking up is what your life is about, then it will happen for you. Keep practicing!
- mumuwu
- Topic Author
15 years 2 weeks ago #65694
by mumuwu
Replied by mumuwu on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
Thanks Owen!
- Dadriance
- Topic Author
15 years 2 weeks ago #65695
by Dadriance
Replied by Dadriance on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
"Just wanted to throw this out as reminder, the practice of me dedicating a sit is really good for my overactive ego; but if you want to wake up, it will be entirely your doing. Nobody can enlighten you, ever.
"
I'm under no delusions about that, but thanks anyways for the reminder!
"
I'm under no delusions about that, but thanks anyways for the reminder!
- OwenBecker
- Topic Author
15 years 2 weeks ago #65696
by OwenBecker
Replied by OwenBecker on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
Not a problem. This came up as a result of a conversation with Kenneth last night. I just don't want to ever give anybody the impression that there is any kind of mystical transference taking place.
My ego is bad enough with out that.
My ego is bad enough with out that.

- mumuwu
- Topic Author
15 years 2 weeks ago #65697
by mumuwu
Replied by mumuwu on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
Not at all Owen. It's more of a solidarity thing (not like I'm donating money to a priest to offer prayers during a mass).
- APrioriKreuz
- Topic Author
15 years 2 weeks ago #65698
by APrioriKreuz
Replied by APrioriKreuz on topic RE: Owen's Practice Journal, Part II
"Just wanted to throw this out as reminder, the practice of me dedicating a sit is really good for my overactive ego; but if you want to wake up, it will be entirely your doing. Nobody can enlighten you, ever. The problem of life and death is yours alone, and the solution to it has to come from your own effort. If waking up is what your life is about, then it will happen for you. Keep practicing!
"
I love this place. Smart people, honest people, good respectful intentions everywhere and excellent ideas for practice.
Every time I don't dedicate my practice or achievements, ego sets in and then reality hits hard. I forget to do this. So, thanks for reminding me Owen
- Alex
"
I love this place. Smart people, honest people, good respectful intentions everywhere and excellent ideas for practice.
Every time I don't dedicate my practice or achievements, ego sets in and then reality hits hard. I forget to do this. So, thanks for reminding me Owen
- Alex