Tummo

Tummo and other kundalini practices and who will go to the highest stages and tantric practices:

I'm getting better at managing the technique, holding for up to 90 seconds. Experience shaking, but no silence yet. Abdomen still blocked.

"Loco, would you be up to sharing instructions for some (or all!) of the other yogas of naropa? You did such an awesome job with Tummo and having specific instructions for the other yogas would be super great."

Hmm, for Phowa I would recommend to take a course with Ole Nydahl, he is a specialist for phowa. He is pretty good with getting signs and seems to enjoy the magical roams. f.e. like this: summercourse.ec/

He has a kind of travelagency for the dead

"I'm getting better at managing the technique, holding for up to 90 seconds. Experience shaking, but no silence yet. Abdomen still blocked. "

good, don't go to tuff, 90 seconds is a lot. remember, there is a powerful and a gentle/subtle version of tummo, choose wisely.

reduceing sideeffects via body: tsa lung before, 9 breaths before, hyperventilating before tummo, reduce contraction of pelvis, or see former posts.

reducing sideeffects via mind:
1. going directly into mahamudra-mode, turning the mind to the senses/now in an enjoying way (which is basicly combining - what is called here- actual freedom with a little selfinquiry. btw of course AF copied its techniques from mahamudra and not the other way round, see the books of gendün rinpoche). This is also a way to get the big E instantly.

2. go into emptiness-mode, one chakra after the other, bottom-up

3. one way or the other - honestly in most cases sideeffects will vanish also if one just keeps going and doesn't care.

"good, don't go to tuff, 90 seconds is a lot. remember, there is a powerful and a gentle/subtle version of tummo, choose wisely.

reduceing sideeffects via body: tsa lung before, 9 breaths before, hyperventilating before tummo, reduce contraction of pelvis, or see former posts."

Thank you. I decided to revisit the tsa lung and follow the video. It does seem like side-effects improve, but I'll take the scenic route. Enjoying the challenge.

Hi Loco, also got a question. Is there any difference between contracting pelvis and holding breath and contracting pelvis and expelling breath from the lungs and just not breathing. When I begin I can do thirty seconds which moves then to forty and then sometimes up to a minute with no breath. I have found it's all about relaxing and enduring calmly, remarkable the extraordinary subtleties one can feel in the body and the huge attenuation of emotion. I do this doing sitting tummo and have found now that I can also do standing which was too violent earlier. Also, the difficulty with anger and energy surges I was struggling with earlier have completely vanished. For large parts of the day now the mind is completely still and empty and there is the sensation that I don't know anything but with the proper stimulus all this information or ideas or understandings appear out of the blue, the sensation is that I don't know where they have come from and a lot of the time, moments later I cannot recall what I have said. That is one little hiccup....I don't seem to be able to remember stuff....and yet, stuff appears when necessary. Can you explain that if you could please.
Much gratitude
paul

The art is to keep the energy of the body high while dying into the now.

If one just lets go and let the ego be overwhelmed by the senses, one gets into this peaceful, sensual, castrated, emotion- and memoryless Actual freedom state (too much endogen opiates).
If one just increases and accumulates "energy", one ends up in a permanent hypomanic, charismatic, hyperspiritual ego-only-trip.

both are ok, but:

In the long run it seems necessary to find a balance between these extremes.

I found one indicator: the SENSE OF WONDER.
when one finds the balance, it rises to it's maximum and becomes completely effortless and permanently arising. (it's more fresh, vivid, liquid and joyful than that AF-peacefulness and more silent and intimate than the supergurustate.)

It is seen as a dramatic increase of thetawaves in the brain (the waves children get when they think about christmas and thats a nice understating description too).

I can not really explain your situation, but it sounds as if you have reached a pretty high level of enlightenment, LOL. what irritates a bit is just that tummo-guys normally don't have these short term memoryproblems, while they appear in other traditions regularly. Can you reformulate the open questions?

Hi Loco,
Thanks for your reply. To reformulate the original question. Because of time constraints I do half an hour in the morning. I noticed if I do the normal tummo you have documented I can't maximise the number of cycles I want to do. So, I decided to improvise. Instead of filling the lungs and holding, I empty them and hold so I get more cycles in a half hour. My original question was to ask if there is any physiological/attainment difference using this improvisation, but perhaps I should reframe it now and ask, do you think this is what may be causing my short term memory loss? Now, as things always move, some of the things you have said on recent posts have resonated with me. I used to do breathing practices with the chakras and I now couple them with sitting tummor with no breath, and then standing tummo with full breath and I have noticed this. Energy levels are higher, more stable and short term memory has improved a little. For some reason there is more 'alertness,' and more wonder so your sense of wonder resonates strongly. However, I remain still a little bit at sea. I guess I'll just have to get used to the sensation of not knowing anything and not knowing what I'm going to say until my mouth opens and then not being able to recall the details of what I said and just having confidence in the fact that it's okay. People find me very honest, open and humble which I guess is no bad thing. On a practical level however, for people who depend on me to do stuff, such as my wife, and do what I say I'm going to do....it's trickier. Perhaps I'll just have to train myself to carry a notebook around with me. What I find helpful about the extra energy is that my body 'pings' so to speak and so I have to burn it by going for a run or doing exercise which in turn boost my aerobic and anaerobic capacity and hence my practice.
Much gratitude
Paul

Hi Cartago,

I experimented a bit since your post, but wasn't able to create the short term loss memory effect via the improvised tummo-version, nor have I heard of it in that context. But it's permanently mentioned in other traditions (see zen: genpo roshi, selfinquiry: , actualism: dharma overground).

"I guess I'll just have to get used to the sensation of not knowing anything and not knowing what I'm going to say until my mouth opens and then not being able to recall the details of what I said and just having confidence in the fact that it's okay...."

Yes, I know that one.
sometimes less ego, less functional; some functions will come back, others won't. In the real world I haven't met one enlightened person (meditators), who stayed completely functional in emptinessmode. thats why they say: don't get stuck in the void )

But in my case the dysfunctionalities appear more when I go into a no-body-mind-only-enlightenment (in the tibetan: only the white tigle is going down into the heart, but the red one doesn't rise upwards --> no red expansion, only mind shut off-->no full enlightenment / only-no-ego) using mental only techniques. sorry all I can say at the moment

I guess thats why Marpa talked about an enlightenment without meditation:

"There are teachings for one to become enlightened with meditation, but I have a teaching that offers enlightenment without meditation", said Marpa "the great translator".

meaning the path of tools (mainly tummo) and from there turning the mind to what is (mahamudra), getting enlightened without ever sitting one (classic) meditation.

Hi Loco,
Thank you for your interest and experimentation. The utube clips were very helpful. I find tummo very interesting. Sitting, I can hold the breath easily for a minute forty and longer, up to fifty seconds with no breath but ironically, standing, often only for fifty seconds as well. But, this is of no concern...I'm far more interested in the subtlety and the noticing of events during the cycle which one's attention is cut off from if one is simply trying to rack up lots of seconds. I prefer many cycles to a few big muscle ones. I'm getting more into the standing though, there is a different energy vibe. Also, a profound awe and sensual nature to life is emerging along with the fearlessness which is easily shared with others...for some reason it is so easy for me now to empower others where as before it was a huge effort just to get people to listen to me. What I really enjoy now is only interest in unleashing the creative in others for their benefit and that of the community. Will report more as it comes up...much gratitude
paul

Hey folks,

check out this link, has potential! thetummoexperiment.wordpress.com/

Bump for this inspiring thread. It's in season here in the north. Started yesterday and held my breath for 2 min today twice and several times 1 30 min that is "comfortable" now.

oh and I should say that I compiled and organized all the instructions from and commentary from this thread, if anybody wants it PM me and I'll email you the .pdf

Have gotten muscle ache in the diaphragm? From the contraction that start at around 1 min .Will go slower with the retentions for a few days. Not that muscle ache bother me but slow and steady is better I think. Can already feel a change in energy and don't think it's imagined because it feels similar to other energetic practices I've done, shaktipat/guru yoga and kriya yoga. Kriya also works with retentions by the way. Did one with retention and focus on the heart center that got me pretty blissed and the stillness after kriya is so nice to sit in.

But stopped kriya because of excessive energy in the head and also did a jhana retreat so got something else to play with for a while.

Have high expectations on tummo. Let's see what it deliver's

Thanks so much for that pdf Andy now I don't have to plow the thread for instruction's. Great dana and have a great weekend!

"oh and I should say that I compiled and organized all the instructions from and commentary from this thread, if anybody wants it PM me and I'll email you the .pdf"

Andy, thanks for putting in the work. The pdf is very well done. Cheers!

A curious question for the tummo veterans, Loco or anyone else that feel he can answer.

Is there really no contraction phase/come down with this practice? Read somewhere in the thread that tummo makes your body be in constant expansion. That sounds great for in the other energy practices I've done there is always after the flying high a lying low phase.

Haven't even started with tummo yet just root locks and breath retentions and yesterday tsa lung and can feel an enormous difference in my mood and energy level. Haven't really had the energy to do anything but the absolute essentials now for a few weeks. But now i suddenly there is a desire to get out so i will attend yoga class now. I feel the body needs it. Would be nice to keep this energy for a while as i was turning into a real couch potato.

That's intriguing Jyet. I don't know of any energy (or meditative) practice that doesn't result in purging/purification, which manifests as low or painful periods or dark night like periods. If this one doesn't, I'd be fascinated to know how or why. Seems like it would violate the laws of spiritual physics...

Yes gira it sounds a bit too good to be true! I guess I'll see for myself in a few weeks, months. I know Loco also mentioned cleansing and dealing with difficult emotions else where so maybe if the constant expansion thing is true. It's after a lot of debris has left.. This sounds more reasonable actually. Maybe I asked my own question?

I did about a month of prep practices, and then a month of attempting Tummo. Although I didn't get the full benefits yet that are described here, I definitely felt an increase in energy. But it seemed like a lot of work for a little bump, so I took a break for a week. I wouldn't say I felt a crash, but I did return to my normal energy level which just wasn't enough anymore. So, in a way, I feel like I'm stuck with Tummo.

Hi guys,
Standing tummo is still too rough on my body so I have been doing sitting tummo. I used to do hill running on my property and always faced the training with a measure of trepidation. It was very painful and quite brutal at times. I haven't done any hill running for almost six months and I ran the hill on the weekend. Tummo has trained my body as though I am hill running and more. I ran the hill comfortably without fear or concern or need for rest. I think the longer you do it, the more 'stuff' you can burn through and the longer your cycles can be the more energy the body has not just up front, but in reserve. I was stunned at what happened. There is now a wonderful ease and kindness in the body and a deep spontaneous connection with others through the gaze which draws people in. And when you speak from the heart people believe you and are moved by what you say because there is no inhibition or reservation or vulnerability. They are warmed and attracted by that too. Hope this helps
Paul

Paul,

You're describing exactly what I'm hoping to gain from this. Thanks for the inspiration. When I do sitting tummo I feel a warm, pleasant glow. But I thought maybe I was missing the boat by not suffering enough with standing, so I've been pushing through it more. Sometimes if I do enough rounds of sitting, I really feel like doing it standing. Maybe that's the ticket.

Jason

Wow Paul my heart is buzzing with warm bliss reading your post. Thanks for the inspiration.

Metta
Erik

You are both very welcome. Much joy to your practice.
Paul